By Swami Veetamohananda and Frédéric Fournier
Translation Louise Thunin
Who do you say that I am ? Jesus asked his disciples this question. But who is he for those who belong to a non-Christian spiritual tradition ? The Reverend Frédéric Fournier questioned Swami Veetamohananda, a monk, and the head of the Gretz ashram, which belongs to the Indian Vedantist, non-dualist tradition. He is also the president of the Vedic Federation of France, which brings together different associations promoting Indian spirituality.
For you and for your monastic order, who is Jesus ? :
Swami : For us, Jesus is an avatar, that is, an incarnation of God. Other avatars exist, for example Krishna. Ramakrishna (1836-1886), whose person and teachings are the basis of our order, said : ˝God’s incarnation is always the same. After immersion in the ocean of life, the One God appears in a certain place and is known by the name of Krishna. And when, after another immersion, He appears in another place, He is known by the name of Christ.˝
FF : The following verse in John 14, I am the Way , the Truth and the Life ; No one comes to the Father but by me, has led a certain number of Christians to believe that Jesus is the only way to God.
Swami : I think the Me that Jesus is speaking of is not the small me, limited by negative emotions, but the great Me, in other words, the Infinite, the Divine. Jesus is the expression of the infinite light that abides in each one of us, as well. The goal of life is to become aware that we too are an expression of this light. A person who follows a spiritual practice allows his great Me to manifest. Our practices are bhakti-yoga (devotion to God), karma-yoga (unselfish action), jnana-yoga (the philosophy which teaches us to discriminate between the Real and the unreal) and dhyana-yoga (silent meditation).
FF : You seem to consider that action in spiritual life is important. Nonetheless, Jesus did not value action as much as he did grace, for example in his conversation with Martha and Mary (Luke 10 : 38-41).
Swami : Grace is the strength of God that is already present, but unto which we must open ourselves. We can be compared to a boat that wind alone can move. What we need to do is open the sails, so that the boat can benefit from the wind.This is what spiritual practice allows : opening to the winds of grace. In karma-yoga, action must be carried out in awareness of God and for Him. In my opinion, Martha and Mary are expressions of action and love, which must always remain united in each of us.
FF : Do you worship Christ ?
Swami : We worship Christ as God Himself. Swami Vivekananda (1863-1902), one of the founders of our order, was deeply touched by the teachings of Christ. About his words, Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God, the Swami declared : ˝In this sentence we find the essence of all religions. If all other sacred scripture were lost, these words alone could save the world.˝ Here is an anecdote: when traveling, the swami always carried a copy of the mystical, fourteenth century work, The Imitation of Jesus Christ. Swami Prabhavananda (1893-1976), another monk from our order, wrote a commentary on the Sermon on the Mount. In our ashram, we celebrate Christmas each year. We offer a puja (a traditional Indian ceremony in honor of Divinity) to Jesus. A minister friend from Germany comes and celebrates a Christian service, during which he preaches on the Gospel narrative of the nativity.
FF : You worship Kirshna and Kali, who are Indian divinities, as well as Jesus. So you consider religious doctrines and dogma to be relative.
Swami : One cannot say, ˝My religion is the only true one.˝ Ramakrishna spoke truly on that subject : ˝Don’t debate over doctrines and religions. They are One. All rivers flow to the ocean! The great water runs down the mountain side over a thousand paths, but it is always the same water. In the future, it will not be important to know what our religion is, whether we love God or Man. Following this philosophy, we organize annual interreligious meetings with Christan, Jewish, Muslim and Buddhist representatives, in order to pool our reflections on our common ideals, and to share our religious practices.
FF : What touches you the most about Jesus ?
Swami : First of all, his ethical perfection. Second, his capacity to serve mankind tirelessly, and his supreme gift of himself for the redemption of humanity. Third, the simplicity and depth of his teaching. His commandment, Love your neighbor as yourself, is a fine example. Indeed, God also lives among the poor. Serving the poor with love is the same as serving God. This is why our Order in India has founded hospitals and schools for the underprivileged.
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